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Episode 830 | Right to Work Debate - YouTube
Channel: New Mexico In Focus, a Production of NMPBS
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>> WELCOME BACK TO THE LINE, THE
RIGHT TO WORK LEGISLATION IS A
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HOT TOPIC IN THE CURRENT 60-DAY
LEGISLATIVE SESSION.
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RIGHT TO WORK BILL CLEARED HOUSE
COMMITTEE LAST WEEK AND TOM
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THERE IS A LOT OF DEBATE OVER
THIS ONE LEADING UP TO THIS
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SITUATION.
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LET'S DEFINE OUR TERMS HERE,
WHAT PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR WHEN
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IT COMES TO RIGHT TO WORK AND
WHAT IT ALL MEANS.
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WHAT IS YOUR SENSE COMING OUT OF
COMMITTEE?
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>> THE SHORT ANSWER IS THAT
RIGHT TO WORK IS THIS YEAR'S
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DRIVER'S LICENSE REFORM ISSUE.
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YOU KNOW, IT IS WHAT EVERYBODY
IS GETTING AROUND AND EVERYBODY
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DEFINING IT THE WAY THEY WANT IT
DEFINED.
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BOTTOM LINE IS ECONOMIC
DEVELOPERS FEEL THAT RIGHT TO
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WORK OR THE FACT THAT
ALBUQUERQUE OR NEW MEXICO RATHER
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IS NOT A RIGHT TO WORK STATE IS
A HINDERANCE TO ATTRACTING MAJOR
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CORPORATIONS.
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AND AS A RESULT, THERE ARE SOME
ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE SAYING
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THIS IS AN ISSUE OF REALLY
IMPACTING JOBS AND DEMOCRATS ARE
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SAYING THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT
IMPACTS FUNDRAISING BECAUSE
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UNIONS TEND TO BE THE LARGEST
SUPPORTERS OF THE DEMOCRATIC
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PARTY.
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WITH ALL THAT SAID, WHERE I COME
DOWN ON THIS IS THAT RIGHT TO
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WORK, OF ALL THE DIFFERENT
DEALS, ACCORDING TO FRIENDS OF
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MINE IN THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
COMMUNITY, THAT ARE IN THE
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PIPELINE RIGHT NOW, NONE OF THEM
ARE DEPENDENT UPON RIGHT TO
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WORK.
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IT IS ALWAYS THE SIDE DISH.
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IT IS NEVER THE MAIN COURSE.
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CORPORATIONS AND MANUFACTURERS
THAT WANT TO WORK HERE AND MOVE
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THEIR BUSINESSES HERE, ARE
LOOKING FOR WATER AND THEY ARE
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LOOKING FOR TAX BREAKS.
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AND THOSE ARE THE TWO MAIN
THINGS.
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SO RIGHT TO WORK IS JUST A
DISTRACTION FOR THIS SESSION AND
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I THINK IT IS NOTHING MORE.
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>> INTERESTING, JOHN HOW DID IT
BECOME THE MAIN COURSE OVER THAT
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ANALOGY.
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>> THIS IS WHERE, JANICE AND I
HAD A GREAT BIPARTISAN SET OF
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EXCHANGES ON ONE ISSUE --
[MULTIPLE VOICES]
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>> YOU KNOW FROM MY PERSPECTIVE,
I REPRESENTED A LOT OF LABOR
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UNIONS OVER THE YEARS, I HAVE
BEEN ENDORSED AS A CANDIDATE AND
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WORKED WITH THEM AS CHAIRMAN OF
THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.
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THE REALITY IS THAT THE ENTIRE
ISSUE IS JUST POLITICAL IN MY
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VIEW.
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IN OTHER WORDS, IT REALLY IS
MOTIVATED TO DEPRIVE THE LEFT
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LEANS OF THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM
OF ONE OF THEIR THE MAJOR
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FUNDING SOURCES.
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IF YOU LOOK AT THE PHRASE RIGHT
TO WORK, THAT IS JUST A VERY
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CLEVER NAME.
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WHAT THE LEGISLATION ACTUALLY
DOES, FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE VERY
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LOW LEVELS OF UNIONIZATION IN
NEW MEXICO.
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SO, IT REALLY HAS VIRTUALLY NO
--
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>> BETWEEN 4 AND 6?%.
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>> RIGHT, AND A LOT OF WORKFORCE
THAT IS UNIONIZED ARE PUBLIC
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EMPLOYEES NOT COVERED BY THIS
PARTICULAR STATUE AND SO THE
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BOTTOM LINE IS THIS WILL HAVE
VIRTUALLY ZERO EFFECT.
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BUT WHAT RIGHT TO WORK
LEGISLATION, SUPPOSED RIGHT TO
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WORK LEGISLATION DOES, IF YOU
NEGOTIATED A CONTRACT WITH YOUR
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EMPLOYER UNDER A UNION
COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT,
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IT ALLOWS PEOPLE TO NOT HAVE TO
PAY FOR THAT BARGAINING SERVICE.
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THERE ARE WORKERS THAT GET
HIGHER WAGES WHEN THEY ARE
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BARGAINING THROUGH A COLLECTIVE
BARGAINING AGENT THAT WILL GET A
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FREE RIDE AND NOT HAVE TO PAY
FOR THOSE KIND OF SERVICES.
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IT IS NOT A RIGHT TO WORK.
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YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO WORK OR YOU
ACTUALLY DON'T HAVE A RIGHT TO
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WORK IN THIS COUNTRY, RIGHT?
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YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO BE FIRED AT
WILL IN THE STATE OF NEW MEXICO.
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SO THE WHOLE IDEA THAT YOU HAVE
A RIGHT TO WORK IS PREPOSTEROUS
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AND BOTTOM LINE IS IF YOU LOOK
AT RIGHT TO WORK STATES, THEY
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HAVE LOWER MEDIAN WAGES THAN
NON-RIGHT TO WORK STATES.
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I LOOK AT IT AS AN ECONOMIC
DEVELOPMENT IDEA AND I THINK TOM
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HAS IT RIGHT, WE NEED TO FOCUS
ON THINGS THAT WE CAN HAVE
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COMMON GROUND ON, WORKER
TRAINING, WATER, RESOURCES, THAT
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IS WHAT REPUBLICANS AND
DEMOCRATS CAN GET TOGETHER ON,
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MAYBE BUILDING PHYSICAL
INFRASTRUCTURE AND THOSE WOULD
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INCREASE JOBS.
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>> A LITTLE BIT OF AGREEMENT ON
THE LAST BIT OF IT BUT
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DISAGREEMENT, OF COURSE, JANICE,
ON THE IDEA ONE SHOULD HAVE THE
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FREEDOM TO PAY OR NOT PAY COMING
IN THE DOOR.
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A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T HAVE A
PROBLEM WITH THAT.
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THAT SEEMS REASONABLE, TO HAVE
THE RIGHT TO NOT HAVE TO PAY TO
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GET INTO A UNION.
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WOULD YOU BE ON THAT SIDE OF THE
ISSUE?
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>> I WOULD AND I THINK IT IS
REASONABLE FOR THE UNION TO
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UPDATE THEIR ACT AND GET THEIR
MEMBERS TO DO AN AUTOMATIC BANK
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DEDUCTION TO PAY THEIR DUES
RATHER THAN THE STATE COLLECTING
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IT AND WRITING A CHECK TO THE
UNION.
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I CAN GET WITH THAT, BUT I AM
TELLING YOU WHAT, THIS IS NOT
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WHAT IS GOING TO CHANGE THE
ECONOMIC LANDSCAPE FOR THE STATE
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OF NEW MEXICO, AND LET ME THROW
IT ON THE TABLE, WHAT IT IS TIME
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TO DO IS FIX OUR GROSS RECEIPTS
TAX AND I AM TELLING YOU WHAT,
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YOU PULL GROSS RECEIPTS TAX DOWN
TO 3%, YOU GET RID OF ALL THE
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EXEMPTIONS AND ALL OF THE, LORD
KNOWS, REDUNDANT, STUPID
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PAPERWORK AND YOU LIMIT CITIES
AND COUNTIES TO 1 1/2%, NOW
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WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOME
ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
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THIS IS NOT IT.
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IT JUST AGGRAVATES ME, THAT, YOU
KNOW, IT IS A TALKING POINTS BUT
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IT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING.
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>> INTERESTING THERE.
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IT SEEMS TO ME -- I LOVE THAT.
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I TALK ABOUT THIS ALL THE TIME,
THE CONSENSUS IS IT WON'T DO
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ANYTHING, SO WHY IS THIS GETTING
SO MUCH TRACTION IN THE
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LEGISLATURE?
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UNLESS I AM MISSING SOME SIDE OF
IT.
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>> I CAN'T SEE THE SIDE OF IT
THAT YOU ARE MISSING.
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I WILL SAY THAT GIVEN WHAT I DO
FOR A LIVING IN TERMS OF THE
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KIND OF THINGS I REPORT ON, I
DON'T SPEND MY TIME TALKING TO
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SITE SELECTORS ABOUT WHETHER
RIGHT TO WORK IS GOING TO HAVE
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AN IMPACT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER
ON ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IN THE
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CITY OF ALBUQUERQUE OR IN THE
STATE OF NEW MEXICO.
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I DID WANT TO ADD, THOUGH, THAT
TO JOHN'S POINT FROM EARLIER,
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THE IDEA OF THE PHRASE RIGHT TO
WORK, FROM A JOURNALIST'S
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PERSPECTIVE, IT IS BOTHERSOME TO
ME THAT OFTEN WE SORT OF FALL
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FOR THESE SLOGANS THAT COME FROM
ONE SIDE OF A DEBATE.
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FOR EXAMPLE, WE DECIDED A LONG
TIME AGO AS JOURNALISM JUST
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DECIDED WE WEREN'T GOING TO GO
WITH PRO CHOICE AND PRO LIFE.
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WE WERE GOING TO SAY PRO
ABORTION AND ANTIABORTION.
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RIGHT TO WORK IS A PHRASE THAT
REALLY CAPTURES ONE SIDE OF THE
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DEBATE AND I THINK WORDS ARE
IMPORTANT IN MY BUSINESS AND I
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WOULD LIKE TO SEE US FIND
ANOTHER WAY TO TALK ABOUT WHAT
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THIS LEGISLATION IS.
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THAT SAID, IT DOES LOOK LIKE IT
IS GOING TO GET THROUGH THE
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HOUSE.
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WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS WITH IT
IN THE SENATE.
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THAT IS WHERE THE BATTLE GROUND
WILL BE FOR THAT PIECE OF
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LEGISLATION AND IN THE END
WHETHER IT HAS IMPACT ON WHAT
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TAKES PLACE HERE, IT DOES SEEM,
FROM WHERE I AM SITTING AND KIND
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OF THINGS I AM COVERING, THERE
ARE BIGGER CONCERNS FOR
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COMPANIES THAT MAY BE LOOKING TO
LOCATE TO NEW MEXICO OR TO THE
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CITY OF ALBUQUERQUE TO SET UP
SHOP.
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>> INTERESTING, TOM.
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IT ALSO GOES BACK TO WATER WHICH
YOU MENTIONED BEFORE, YOU KNOW
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WHAT I MEAN, ABOUT TAXES AND ALL
THAT KIND OF THING.
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>> WE APPLY THE GROSS RECEIPTS
TAX TO WATER AND SO WHEN I SAY
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IT IS TIME TO UPDATE WHAT WE'RE
DOING, GET RID OF THE PAPERWORK,
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THEN IT MAKES WATER MORE
ATTRACTIVE.
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I AM SORRY, TOM.
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>> I MEAN, JUST AS AN OBSERVER,
THIS IS FANTASTIC, THE
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BIPARTISANSHIP THAT IS TAKING
PLACE, IF I HAD $10 ON THIS, NOT
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THAT I AM DOING LEGALIZED
GAMBLING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT,
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I WOULD HAVE LOST MY MONEY.
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NEW MEXICO FIRST HAS DONE A
GREAT JOB.
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AND I HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO
WORK WITH NEW MEXICO FIRST ON
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THE TOPIC AND ISSUE OF WATER AND
I THINK THEY ARE BRINGING GOOD
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CONVERSATION TO THE TABLE THAT
WE NEED TO LOOK AT AS A STATE.
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WHEN IT REALLY COMES DOWN TO IT,
WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT THE WATER
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POLICY IS AND HOW IT INTERACTS
WITH THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
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POLICY.
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>> ON THAT NOTE, THAT IS WHAT I
WANT TO PICK UP.
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IS THIS A FUNCTION OF THIS
LEGISLATION IS PICKING UP A VOID
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OR FILLING A VOID THAT WAS NOT
FILLED BEFORE THIS LEGISLATION,
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OR THIS SESSION, EXCUSE ME, WAS
STARTED?
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MEANING IS THIS GOING TO AT THE
END OF THE DAY BE A BIG
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DISTRACTION THAT WE LOOK AT A
YEAR FROM NOW AND SAY, WHY DID
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WE SPEND ALL THAT TIME ON THIS?
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RIGHT TO WORK.
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AND SHOULD THAT VOID HAVE BEEN
FILLED BEFORE THE SESSION BY THE
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GOVERNOR OR SOMEBODY SAYING THIS
IS THE DIRECTION WE SHOULD BE
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GOING IN.
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RIGHT TO WORK IS NOT THE ANSWER,
THIS IS THE ANSWER.
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>> I BELIEVE SO.
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FUNDAMENTALLY IT IS A
DISTRACTION AND I THINK IT IS A
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WAG THE DOG KIND OF APPROACH IN
THAT IT IS TAKING THE EYE OFF OF
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THE FOCUS THAT WHAT IS OUR
ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT APPROACH?
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>> RIGHT.
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EXACTLY.
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>> I WILL SAY, THERE IS A
LIBERTARIAN PRINCIPLE ARGUMENT
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THAT YOU KIND OF OUTLINED ABOUT
THIS KIND OF LEGISLATION, THAT
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PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE FORCED TO
PAY DUES TO A UNION THAT THEY
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DISAGREE WITH.
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THAT IS A PRINCIPLED ARGUMENT
AND IF THAT IS WHY PEOPLE WERE
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PUSHING LEGISLATION, IF THAT IS
WHAT THEY WERE GOING UP TO THE
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HEARING THAT WAS IN THE HOUSE,
AND PASSED IT THROUGH THE FIRST
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HURDLE, IF THAT IS WHAT THEY
WERE TALKING ABOUT, I WOULD
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THINK IT IS A LEGITIMATE
PROJECT.
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BUT THAT IS NOT WHAT ANYBODY IS
TALKING ABOUT.
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NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT THE ONE
PHILOSOPHICAL POINT THAT YOU CAN
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MAKE ARGUMENT FOR THIS
LEGISLATION ON, FIRST AMENDMENT
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FREE EXPRESSION GROUNDS.
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I DON'T WANT TO ASSOCIATE WITH
THE UNIONS WHY SHOULD I BE
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FORCED TO PAY DUES.
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THAT IS NOT THE PEOPLE'S
ARGUMENT.
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THEY ARE MAKING ARGUMENT THEY
THINK IT IS GOING TO IMPROVE THE
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NEW MEXICO ECONOMY AND FACTS ARE
NOT ON THEIR SIDE.
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>> I WANTED TO SAY
REPRESENTATIVE DENNIS ROCH IS
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THE SPONSOR OF THIS PARTICULAR
BILL AND HAVING LISTENED TO HIM
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I ACTUALLY BELIEVE THAT HE IS
TAKING THE PRINCIPLE POSITION.
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UNFORTUNATELY, ONCE YOU PUT IT
IN THE HOPPER, IT IS NOT YOUR
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BILL ANYMORE.
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>> I THINK THAT THERE ARE PLENTY
OF MEMBERS IN THE HOUSE
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INCLUDING REPRESENTATIVE ROCH
WHO HAVE THAT PRINCIPLE STANCE,
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BUT IF YOU LISTEN TO THAT
HEARING WHAT IT WAS TALKING
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ABOUT IS THIS IS GOING TO CREATE
JOBS.
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>> EXACTLY RIGHT.
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>> THAT'S ALL THE TIME WE HAVE
FOR THIS WEEK.
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WE ALSO TALKED ABOUT THE ONGOING
INVESTIGATION INTO THE MURDER OF
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11 WOMEN FOUND IN GRAVES ON THE
WEST MESA SIX YEARS AGO.
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VISIT US ONLINE AT NEW MEXICO
INFOCUS.ORG FOR THAT DISCUSSION
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AND A LOT MORE.
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>> IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW OUR
COVERAGE OF THE LEGISLATURE OR
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WATCH SEGMENTS FROM TODAY'S
SHOW, VISIT OUR WEBSITE,
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NEWMEXICOINFOCUS.ORG.
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ALSO CONNECT WITH US ON FACEBOOK
AND TWITTER.
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AS ALWAYS WE APPRECIATE YOUR
TIME AND EFFORT TO STAY INFORMED
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AND ENGAGED.
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I AM GENE GRANT.
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WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK INFOCUS.
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