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Supreme Court Hears Arguments In Challenge To Affordable Care Act | Andrea Mitchell | MSNBC - YouTube
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the justices hearing oral arguments this
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morning on whether to throw out the
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affordable care act
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eight years after the landmark decision
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to uphold president obama's signature
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legislative accomplishment
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with 20 million americans or more racing
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for a decision
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that could strip them of their health
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care coverage in the middle of a
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pandemic
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responsible now for more than 240 000
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deaths in the uh in the united states
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nbc justice correspondent pete williams
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joins me now pete what did you hear from
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the justices today
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well the argument is just wrapping up
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andrea the last few minutes of it but
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my guess is based on the questions the
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justices are asking that they are not
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prepared to strike down
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obamacare i don't think there are five
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votes on this court
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to do what the 18 red states are asking
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the supreme court to do so remember the
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history here the supreme court
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originally upheld the law as a
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legitimate use
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of congress's taxing power the argument
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was
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congress can't order you to buy
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something so it's unconstitutional what
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the supreme court said in 2012 was no
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congress gave you a choice either by
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insurance or pay a tax so that's the
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that's why it upheld it as a tax then in
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2017
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with the republicans controlling
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congress they said okay we'll set the
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tax at zero
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so now the states say that the there's
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this you can't save it as a tax and so
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therefore it's unconstitutional
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i think i'm not sure that there are five
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votes to go with the red states on any
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of the three points the supreme court
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has to decide the first is are the
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states
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injured enough to give them standing to
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bring this lawsuit
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and they basically said well you know we
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have to fill out some forms and more
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people have signed up for medicaid
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several of the justices said how does it
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make sense to say
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now that without a penalty more people
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are going to sign up for medicaid
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than would have signed up before the tax
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was repealed
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when they would have had to pay a
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penalty that doesn't seem to uh stand up
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to common sense
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secondly is this still a mandate or not
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at several of the justices say without a
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penalty there is no mandate this is just
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sort of like
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as stephen breyer said a law that says
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buy bonds or go plant a tree
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it's just suggesting what you ought to
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do but there isn't any mandate any
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longer
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and then i think the trickiest one for
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the states is this the states have
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argued
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argued you you now that if you find the
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mandate unconstitutional you have to say
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the entire law falls
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and here i think there are at least five
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votes including the chief justice
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including conservative brett kavanaugh
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to say
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no the best evidence that we look at
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when deciding whether a law has to be
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struck down because part of it's invalid
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is what did congress say and what they
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say is in 2017
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congress said all we're going to take
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away is the tax they left the rest of
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the law intact
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in fact the solicitor general from
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california said today congress
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considered repealing the entire law and
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didn't do it
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so for all those reasons andrea it
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seemed based on the questions and
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comments from the justices today
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that there are not five votes here that
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obamacare will be spared
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that is fascinating and of course amy
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coney barrett was part of this
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oral argument today anything significant
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coming from the new
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newest justice i i don't think so for
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this reason i
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i think she was following the questions
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from the other justices she didn't
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really tip her hand strongly one way or
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the other
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but even if you score her as a
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dependable conservative who would be
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willing to strike down obamacare
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you don't get to five because you got
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brett kavanaugh
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and the chief justice who are likely
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going to vote with the liberal
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justices to say even if the states have
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standing to bring this lawsuit
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even if the individual mandate is
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unconstitutional
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we can still save the rest of the law we
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just cut out the mandate which
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effectively doesn't do anything right
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now anyway and as a matter of fact
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samuel alito one of the conservatives
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said when congress originally passed
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this law the individual mandate was seen
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like
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an essential piece of an airplane that
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would keep it in the air
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now he says we know the health care law
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continues to work without it
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so i don't think there's a majority of
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the court that's going to buy the
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state's argument here
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hey there i'm chris hayes from msnbc
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